The Proton MPV You Ask?

I’m creating this post because I noticed right after the launch of the new Proton Saga interest in the much anticipated Proton MPV has risen dramatically. This blog in particular has also not been spared!ย So much so that my previous write up on the RED and Saga has been flooded with comments pertaining to the MPV.

No doubt the press has gotten wind of Proton’s intention to launch the people mover early next year, and this isย fueled further by statements by Proton’s upper management which coincided with the news.

Personally, Iย akin this vehicle asย the first true Malaysian People Mover due to it being the first MPV built by Malaysia’sย first nationalย car company. I don’t know about you but to me that’s reason enough to celebrate. As the first company entrusted to put the nation ‘on wheels’ and spearhead the Industrial Master Plan, the up coming MPV will continue Proton’s mission to provide affordable transportation to Malaysians.

Feel free to jot your comments here. It could be about what you wish for, what you feel is needed for a winning formula, what you think Proton should avoid, or simply just words of advice and encouragement to the people who are closest to the design of the MPV.

Join meย as part of this journey and make youself heard!

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94 thoughts on “The Proton MPV You Ask?

  1. Bring the Malaysian People Mover to our showroom, so we can dominate big family segment throughout malaysia and hopefully asean & perhaps world.
    Tahniah & terima kasih atas usaha anda! Maju P1 utk semua.. P1 for all and all for P1.

  2. HOORAY!!! YOU ROXX, AZLANO!!!

    I can see a sliding door there, n the rear lights is kinda slim n horizontal ala Estima there ๐Ÿ˜€

    It looks like a big MPV in the same class as Grandis, Estima, Alphard, or Odyssey. Dun forget to include a reverse sensor as std, n an extra mirror which can reflect view of the MPV’s bumper, like ones in most SUVs I think…n some MPVs I think.

  3. My wish for ‘my proton mpv’ soon…

    Size…bigger than WISH..at least like ESTIMA.

    For reference…look at Citroen Grand C4 Picasso.Among the best mpv 2007 at UK.How they do it and fullfilled customers need.

    Good luck proton!!

  4. A la Mazda5, not bad dude. This C-segment MPV will rock Malaysians again just like smaller sibling Saga Mk II.

    Should have:
    neatly storage folding mechanism like those found in new Estima Mk III if Proton using sliding door type (also found in smaller MPV like Isis, Mazda5). Strap or electric operated for high end variant

    AC blowers for middle row and 3rd row is added advantage BUT too costly

    Ergonomic and neatly design dashboard, gear lever in the dash rather than floor, for space savvy interior

    Azlan:

    A lot better than Livina I guess?

  5. I prefer a low roofline MPV such as Wish or stream or Mazda 5. Any bigger than that such as estima, alphard or Naza Ria will be too big, costly and also fuel guzzler. I believe Malaysian people nowadays like big comfortable people mover, but they still value fuel efficient vehicle. As you know, the petrol price is going only one way and that is up!

    A big plus for me if the front exterior styling cue are based on the Lotus APX. The sleek bodyline will have low drag coefficient which translated to fuel efficient and simply nice to look at. Signal lights on side mirrors and rear led lightings are also additional plus points

    Interior size should accomodate 7 adult nicely without sacrificing luggage space. Its meaningless if it can seat 7 people but can only carry 1 mid size bag. Please don’t expect us to put additional luggage storage box on the roof. I hate it!

    Interior quality should have a middle class feel. With prominent dark color high quality textured plastic plus a bit of fabric such as the persona. I really like the bright led type meter clusters such as on Myvi, Altis or Camry. It really projected the feels of high class. Hope the new Proton MPV will be the first Proton to have this feature.

    If the rear doors are really going to be sliding doors, please don’t forget to put foldable side arm rest on the second row seat. I felt really awkward when I sat on Mazda 5 aka Premacy JDM version which is without the arm rest. I believed that most of us are used to rest our arm on the door arm rest but sliding doors don’t have this, am I right?

    If the new Proton MPV have all the above features and price between RM 70K ~ 85K, then for sure I will be one of the earliest to book it.

    Just my 2 cents!

  6. temmy -> that’s the spirit! TQ for your support. mid or full size MPV? tungguuuu… ๐Ÿ˜‰

    tokmoh & azlina -> that picture is only for illustration purposes. it has nothing to do with the Proton MPV. i think… hehehe.

    keon2812 -> hope you’re enjoying your nippy Savvy! btw, what SUV?? ๐Ÿ™‚

    empevee -> a lot of people are wishing the same! not that long a wait really…

    Karl -> The Livina? a ‘has been’ in my book…

  7. yo mr PROTONdesignking… Malaysian People Mover? hmm people mover ka? alamak, so i guess it should oso be a base line model of a 7 / seater la? ehehe hmm people mover as in Livina / Innova kinda line la kan. not the Wish / Stream class eh? anyhow, good luck bro and do make us proud, after all the upcoming Proton MPV had a “Malaysia” word in it.. make us proud bro..

  8. a good decision indeed to have affordable mpv for malaysian.. as we know that automotive market in malaysia is always family oriented, so instead of packing six people in a sedan.. they should consider mpv..
    fatality index in malaysia still shows some gap to the international benchmark.. my concern for this mpv is safety as i foresee this upcoming mpv is gonna be more favorable than saga08.. so i hope that safety factors are one of main focus on this new mpv.. be it active or passive..
    anyway.. keep up the good work! congratulations for recent saga success! it always good to see proton’s progressing on the right track now..~

    one quick question here: higher cc engine or force induction? hehe..

  9. Proton MPV!!! Keep it up!
    My suggestion:-
    Sunroof,Power window each corner,Disc brake each corner with abs ebd,Projector head lamp,airbags,double din player, reverse sensor,electric mirror…

    cheers!!!

  10. Mr Azlano,

    Here are my wish list for the upcoming Proton MPV :

    1. AFFORDABLE : Should be good enough for us who like Stream and Wish so much but couldn’t quite afford their price. The range of between minimum of RM75K to RM90K max will be just nice for Proton to make some (local) profits i guess ๐Ÿ™‚

    2. ATTRACTIVE : The look should be on par or better than the latest Honda Stream, I hope. I am not a big fan of Wish but well, that should be included as well as the benchmark. Low slung and low center of G with some clues of the New Saga front face married with the aggressive stance of new Stream. Wow, that will rock them , bro. I can send you some of my sketches.. i am a car freak too, man.

    3. SAFE : Please include all those latest safety features and technology. I believe Proton can afford to package them right and produce it at the right price again.

    4. SAVE : … on fuel of course. I trust Proton with their advance fuel-saving engine technology too.

    5. FEATURES : All things which can make us the buying public happy ! That would include the adequate cool air to the third row passengers and the access to enough storage spaces. (err.. can I include the sliding sun-roof as a feature as well? he he..) The last row passengers too will appreciate the easy access and ingress with a simple to operate mechanism.

    6. QUALITY : I hope Proton will keep up the good build quality of Persona and New Saga to the MPV, or make it better! People will buy it regardless of the price if they see a reliable good quality product and workmanship and good after sales services. This is 2008 and Proton I hope will continue to bring to the public a world class quality product and compete with the big players.

    Thank you.

  11. azlano,
    is there any possibility readers to contribute sketches, ideas visually, i got some.. (although its laughable hehe,,)
    i would like to,

    thanks,

  12. Please put ABS break system, SRS airbags, 4 disk breaks.. thats the least standard now in car world today for christ sake!

  13. Dear Azlan,

    Nice to hear from ya about Livina. Then, we assume Proton MPV OK when it come to design (both exterior and interior) BUT now issue of powerplant, existing offering 1.6, 2.0 V6 definitely thing of the past.

    We must find best engine to complement our MPV, high torque is inevitable dude. 1.8 at least with 140ps and 200Nm from gasoline or 130ps 280Nm from turbodiesel is best bet from Proton.

    Just my opinion.

  14. naaim.zee -> thanks for dropping by!

    amad -> indeed we hope it’ll be as much a success as the new Saga (if not better). safety will be an important part of the cars design; catering specifically for our local legal requirements. btw, if your focus is on safety why have high cc engines right? ๐Ÿ˜‰

    mohdjiman -> bro, with all those things how on earth are we to be affordable?? remember, we’re here as part of a bigger agenda i.e. a National Project to bring affordable transportation to all Malaysians, not to just a select few!

    madimat -> wow! that’s a long list you got there! thanks! from your writing, i think you’ll enjoy what we can offer! ๐Ÿ˜‰ …

    azlina -> unfortunately there’s no way to share your works of art here at the moment… why don’t you create a Flickr or Photobucket account and link it here?

    pretencious -> i’m sure christ would approve… but your definition of ‘standard’ could be one sided. from our research not everyone wants to pay for such items.

    karl -> yes, powertrain is really a thorny issue. but rest assured we are doing our best to balance cost and power.

  15. azlan – i heard that the “1.6 campro cocktail” similar to twin turbo(170hp + good torque at low to mid rpm) will be used for the proton MPV.

  16. Proton should produce mpv for the mass taking a clue such models as avanza, innova or livina though they are low cost mpv whilst stream, wish or caldina etc are just another wagon.

    Have you considered the suitable name ? I would suggest “FESTIVA”

  17. azlina -> you need to work on your detailing e.g. the tyres are too elongated. good effort though!

    theking -> are you sure you’re not working for Proton?! hehehe… to be honest, that’s news to me.

  18. this 2 for now,
    my intention the mpv bit continental look, intervene by some crisp gesture from proton own tiger image, -i know people out there gonna laugh,,he he
    anyway its very crude,

  19. To simplify what is needed for a successful MPV….from Proton

    1. Third row legroom + ample luggage space when the third row is up.

    2. Soft touch plastics on door trims, and every area that comes to contact often.

    3. Low end power. Enough to to pull a full load from a stop, with ease.

    4. Styling. Think Toyota Wish rather than Toyota Innova

    5. Price – at least 20% less than competitor’s price.
    (Unless if comparing against Avanza – which would be hard to do)

    5 simple steps to ensure that the MPV becomes like the Saga or better, rather than Juara.

  20. azlan…just to know about progression

    from sketches until refining..how long?
    from sketches to 3D models…how long?
    and..from 3D models to clay models…how long? hehe…banyak soal la pulak…

    lastly…soalan cepu emas…itu full clay models dah ada ke?…hehe

    tq

  21. Dear Azlan,

    If Lotus Elise S2 2004 (USA model) powertrain outsourced from Toyota 1796cm3, 2ZZ-GE engine; perhaps it’s not unusual for our carmaker to do same thing for our own MPV. Toyota stable also have potent 2.0 (130ps) and 2.2 D-4D (150ps and 180 respectively) easily can comply EURO-IV (the problem is our very own diesel mere on par with Jurassic age).

    Even with only 130ps torque is enormous for it class (300-320Nm) let alone the 2.2 180ps with staggering 400 Newton! Easily to mate with the likes of big size MPV like Estima!

    The 2.0D4-D engined Avensis Tourer have almost 1500kg (I don’t think next Proton MPV will have this weight as it’ll translate into high FC) and still enjoy decent FC, combined almost 50MPG! Extra urban 60MPG and city driving at 39.2MPG. Sound great, huh?

    Is it possible to do that brother?

  22. theking -> i know Paul … you can build as many models as your budget & time allows! they’re not cheap ya know!

    empeevee -> in a typical program, the entire front end activities can take anywhere between 4 to 12 weeks, excluding models. that’s another 8 to 16 weeks, at least. there are exceptions though… we have lots of clay models in my studio, which one are you referring to? wakaka..

    Karl -> in theory what you said is possible.. but when you really do the economics of it things don’t look so rosy. everyone wants power and size but when you show them the cost impact, they freak out. that’s the reality of it.

    Self-Proclaimed Advisor -> we’re listening! good (but some are expensive) points!

    rosli -> a bit early for naming i think! ๐Ÿ˜‰

  23. My 2 cents bro:

    *Exterior :

    Would prefer it to look more like Wish than Estima.
    The exterior should have an expensive look styling. Just like the brilliant job proton did with Persona. The styling made a car what supposed to be a stretch of Gen-2 exteriorly looks elegant, distinctive and expensive.

    I think proton has made a lot of improvements in terms of exterior looks and styling starting with Satria Neo, new Savvy, Saga and Persona. Good eye catching designs. So hopefully the next MPV continues the `saga`. Just hopefully it doesnt look something like the new Waja. I find the front grill and the rearlight being an eyesore, compared to the original design of waja. (hopefully if there is the next facelifted waja, hope p1 does something about the grill and the 3 horizontal line and a circle at the rearlight)

    *Interior :

    Something that proton needs to work more on after successfully improving with the exterior. A fresh dashboard design perhaps. (not just for the mpv, but also for if there is a new facelifted waja) should have the elegant look (something like toyota’s interior). dont mind if it is plastic as long as it doesnt look cheap and fragile. good legroom and also boot size. and yes, practicality. haha, i like the cup holders emphasis in the design of the new saga. simple practical things can make people attracted to it.

    *Engine :
    Good torque at low rpm ๐Ÿ˜€ so that it doesnt feel like the car is dragging when accelerating from stop.

    Fuel economy as well pls ๐Ÿ˜€ would appreciate it a lot. I bet if Proton can make an MPV which is good in fuel consumption, it will easily knockout the korean mpvs such as naza ria/kia carnival like.

    Thats it…I sincerely want proton’s success. hoping the best for p1.

  24. Btw bro, forgot to say, ur blog rocks bro! thanks for enlightening us and giving us the space to provide feedback for proton! ๐Ÿ™‚

  25. I’ve owned an Avanza & now driving a Hyundai Trajet. Have also driven serena, innova & ria. Most MPV are either saloon like (wish, stream, livina, grandis etc) or with high clearance (avanza, innova, trajet, serena, ria etc). I think Proton MPV should be :

    1. Monocoque chassis (unlike innova) but not too high clearance for better ride & handling & better looks. Innova, avanza & serena are too tall & their handling terrible
    2. Min 2 airbags & abs for safety
    3. Comfortable third row seating for adults.
    4. Still enough storage space when third row is up
    5. Split third row seats so that that can fold one seat for storage if necessary. Third row seats can fold down flat. Not hanging out like innova
    6. 3 seats for second row with the middle can be taken out if necessary so that you have either 2/3-3-2 or 2/3-2-2 arrangement. Second row seats can be removed if required
    7. 3 seats for first row if possible. If not leave the area empty for access (trajet,ria). Gear lever has to be at steering or dashboard though (trajet,ria)
    8. A/C blower for second & third row. If don’t have for second row, third row must have blower. Single blower like wish & livina just not sufficient.
    9. Normal door (not sliding). Sliding door too heavy for children unless auto but expensive
    10. Front engine not underneath like Suzuki APV (loud and hot)
    11. A lot of storage holes
    12. Price below RM 75 k. If not, people will go for avanza 1.5, citra (carens II later) & livina
    13. Good exterior styling (tiger eyes, wau bulan etc) not too conservative like new saga
    14. Better interior (look at new elantra – low price but superb interior)
    15. B, M & H line for people to choose

    To go for something like stream, wish or grandis will be heavy & needs bigger engine and will be expensive. I think it should be like livina but maybe a few inch longer & wider. Livina is 1200 kg so proton mpv goes to 1300 the campro CPS 125 bhp is still ok to pull the mpv. Price would not be too high then.

    Just my 2 cents

  26. Bro Azlano,

    Roughly, can you hint to us on the dimension of the coming Proton MPV .. can bro? Izzit more likely to be about the size of Wish, Stream or Grand Livina ?

    I have sat inside the Livina twice, (and never been inside any Stream or Wish, .. yet..) and personally I think it is kind of small,.. i mean the width. My Waja is somehow feels bigger and more spacious when I compared both the driver’s and passenger’ space, even though the Livina make use of the lighter colored interior. (BTW my Waja is the standard 2003 model with those boring gray interior.. ha ha..)

    So hopefully for the Proton very first MPV the cabin will be at least of the Waja’s comfortable size plus the extra row of good enough seat for 2 more adults.

    Thank you.

  27. Dear Azlan,

    What da ya think about Mits GRANDIS + INNOVA? Or Nissan Forum aka Elgrand Concept?

    The former (Grandis, Innova) already shown their (stone) age…ehem ehem though spacious and (Innova) accepted in few market BUT it rather due to it brand, TOYOTA. I hope these two model never inspired our next MPV.

    I guess for below RM70k cost without consumption tax (in Japan) +profit+shipment etc if we brought here 2.3l 5speed AT Mazda MPV have character over Estima and the likes of D-segment MPV.

    Imagine if we can reduce it weight and mate with better powertrain Azlan? I do believe Innova is to Uncle-ish for us and Grandis is a bit age and never get goof review from UK journalists.

  28. dear bro azlan….

    member saye bagitau yg mpv proton nanti
    akan dipasang dgn campro 1.6…
    dia dpt info ni dari pak cik dia yg kerje kt proton…
    just nak kepastian dari bro azlan…

    ape2 pun saye ttp sokong kereta nasional….
    tak banyak negara boleh buat kereta dengan keupayaan rakyat mereka sendiri…

    pndpt saye utk mpv proton ni…
    yang saye harapkan kalau boleh
    ade faktor wow!
    mcm buat org percaya tak percaya proton
    boleh bina mpv mcm tu…
    lebih kurang mcm tulah..

    sorry off topik….
    bro azlan klu boleh story sikit perkembangan
    waja replacement model,kalau boleh ye…

    semoga berjaya proton 4 your mpv project!
    bro azlan too!
    ๐Ÿ™‚

  29. not to forget leather seat, coz tak kotor sangat macam aku tengok Grand livina… kat showroom… ramai2 masuk then budak lupa bukak kasut… dah kotor tempat duduk.

  30. theking & azlano–>The clay model that has been completed, is it the 1st or the final one? I thought there has been a design freeze imposed, hence we will be able to see the mpv in mid-2009?

  31. BTW, I understand that the mpv will be built on proton’s new platform, slightly bigger than waja.

    Azlano, can you clarify this please.

  32. imran -> thanks! interesting points you have. a point to note: as designers, we can always make things look elegant & expensive. unfortunately it’s the materials and processes which usually let us down. basically you get what you pay for! (a crude concept i know but reality bites).

    theking, naaim.zee & BrusLi -> let me ask you, if the car is supposed to be produced during 1st quarter 2009 at what stage is the development at now? logic will tell you what you want to know… also, don’t believe everything you hear unless it’s from a reputable informant! *wink2*

    ahsk2 -> thanks for your ideas … i think you’ll be pleased with our design! ๐Ÿ˜‰ … although in reality we can never really please everyone. but hopefully the general target market will attest to it!

    madimat -> unfortunately that’s not possible ๐Ÿ™‚ … sounds like you put a lot of emphasis on car interiors. you’re right about the Livina is, it is smaller than expected. and we will not make that same mistake.

    Karl -> the Grandis & Innova are full size MPVs therefore are meant to be spacious. i don’t want to be judgemental but they aren’t the best references for design. but they do fit a budget and a certain target market (die hard Toyota/Mitsu buyers for instance). the trick is to find our own niche so we can enjoy our own piece of the pie unpreturbed.

    1.3GLi -> untuk kepastian kena tunggu sikit la bro… pasal Waja replacement tu pulak kena tunggu topik baru… lama lagi kot!

    nazri -> thanks but always be aware that leather seats are an expensive option. not everyone wants it too.

    chaku -> Kia Rondo is the new Carens (which could be the next Citra). not a bad car really; spacious and nice equipment level. looks way better than the old Carens (but the rear is too bottom heavy). but still can’t beat Wish, Mazda5 or Stream.

  33. azlano, so i suppose you are saying that P1 upcoming MPV will looks better than Rondo?that’s gonna b good.

    looking forward for another hint

  34. Thanks azlano, I can conclude that by now the mpv development has already reached the advanced stage. The exterior design should have been frozen by now.

    Furthermore, you wouldnt have much time to entertain us if you are still working on the basic design, right?

  35. BrusLi, I thought so too. That’s why I read from somewhere which the writer claims that he heard it from insider people, that the new proton mpv prototype is already running around on test track inside proton plant equipped with all sorts of sensors for testing and fine tuning.

    Furthermore, heard also that the MPV product knowledge training for the sales people is schedule to start somewhere in JUN or JULY this year.

    I think we should be able to see this MPV on road test soon, camouflaged of course! Am I right Azlano?

  36. Azlano, can you tell us whether the new mpv interior (dashboard design) will be totally new design or something taken from the current proton model? I hope it will something fresh, elegant and a bit up market look.

  37. Azlano…

    I think u can u say like this.hehe ” This is not just Malaysian mover but this is the MPV that Malaysian/Asian waiting for!.U’ll never regret to have it.It’s time to saving money n waiting.If u are Toyota, Honda or Nissan freak…It’s time to think and change to PROTON!!…hehe…can u? ๐Ÿ˜›

    By the way…is Damian and Zafruddin still there?…I knoe both are ur friend and they are men who designed n styling our gen2.

    Just curios..When proton make a project..all the designer in proton get involve or not.Or..just like this MPV..u and ur friends incharge…For waja replacement..there are another guys n so on.

    Tq

  38. chaku -> of course! hehe.. btw, you’ve got good Photoshop skills. need to improve your detailing though! keep it up. ๐Ÿ˜‰

    BrusLi -> time management is a discipline by itself..

    nd -> a friend of a friends in-laws brother heard from their friends brothers sister… all rumours really. or are they? for now, that’s for me to know and for you to find out! … the MPV interior is something special because Proton has never done a MPV from the ground up before. it will also have its surprises…

    empeevee -> Damian left donkey years ago… we work as a team in Proton Design, much like any other design group. we always try to have as many as possible involved for every major project but our resources have to be distributed evenly. this is due to the fact that we have many projects on going as the same time.

    nazri -> seperti yang telah dihebahkan di media, ia dijangka akan berada di pasaran awal tahun depan.

  39. azlano..it’s actually a WIP.later i’ll resume the work.
    maybe not,cause i’m going to wait for more hints from you.hehe

    do stumble upon major difficulties designing your first MPV from ground up?i bet you are,but i want to know some examples

  40. tenkiu bro azlan 4 reply my question…
    waa,makin hangat discussion ni….
    x sabar nak tengok prototaip mpv proton buat test…
    mcmmanala rupa parasnya ye,eiii…..

  41. Azlano, Nice to know that the MPV dashboard will be a totally new design. I hope the steering wheel too will be a new design built with good material. The current gen-2’s feel cheap, the neo’s one not bad but still can be improved, the waja’s one too outdated already.

    IMHO, steering wheel design & feel is very important as its the first thing that a driver touch after he sat inside the car. It can give the first impression of the overall build quality of the interior.
    Just my 2 cents.

  42. Forgot another question….

    As the MPV design is already finalized and there should be a prototyped built already, how do you rate your satisfaction level?

    What I mean is, I knew that there will be some differences comparing your original design and actual product built due to cost or engineering or production constraint. So how big is the differences? How much do you satisfy with the end product?

  43. Looks like the livina is selling like hot cakes that even my younger brother just bought one. Just got back from balik kampung & can see the livina everywhere. If only it has A/C for the third row, 2 inch wider, 1 more inch between 2 & 3 row, 2 more inch behind the 3 row for storage, more powerful engine (for the 1.6), it would be perfect. Hope proton MPV is mid size like the livina but with the above improvement. I think M’sians prefer sedan like MPV. People bought innova because they can’t afford wish and people bought avanza, well because there’s no other choice for that price (unless you call rusa, APV or kangoo, mpvs). Maybe carens II is better but can only see that from the internet. Naza is selling the basic citra for 65k & I guest they’re clearing stocks before launching the new citra. If priced around the livina it would be an interesting fight. The old citra sucks anyway since there’s no A/C at the back, the 3 row only fits toddlers & no space behind the 3 row.

    If the new proton mpv is midsize, the livina & carens II will be your main competitors. Hope you guys have studied the design of both & come up with something better & as typical M’sians expectations, cheaper. Proton should start driving around with its “camorflaged” model soon like what you guys did with the persona & saga. Then people can hold on their purchase & wait for the proton mpv. But if your design is worse, they will buy other brands now. You decide.

    If you guys are coming out will a full size mpv please note:
    1. The market for full size MPV is smaller in Msia & SEA for that matter. A mid size MPV has a much bigger market
    2. Price will be high & to sell a 100k proton is difficult. A lot of M’sian would buy a competing foreign brand even if the price is 30% higher. Just look at persona, many people will still go for Vios.
    3. Does proton has a bigger capacity engine? Please, please don’t put in a continental engine & transmission like the waja 1.8/savvy or it is going to be doomed as well. I used to own a waja 1.8 & in terms of handling the best proton I had (after iswara & wira). But sold it off after 2 years due to the amazingly many problems. Sworn never will touch another proton again.

    Hope that you don’t take my comments personally but a lot of M’sians are proud of Proton and wants Proton to be successful. If you guys can keep producing cars like the recent persona & saga & maintain the quality, many others who have sworn not to touch proton again will come back in droves.

    My 2 cents.

  44. chaku -> don’t hold your breath k!? … car design, whatever the type, is always a challenge as each one is unique. the MPV obviously presents some interesting challenges like packaging & style compromises, power to weight ratio, interior comfort, even glass to body relationship! all in a days work…

    1.3GLi -> sabaq no… tengok2 la kalau ada spyshot keluar dlm Forum2…

    nd -> you’re right ๐Ÿ˜‰ the steering wheel is indeed one of the most important designs for the interior. it needs to feel and look right. we have learnt from the past and will work with our suppliers to get a good balance all round.

    is the design finalized?? hmm.. i put a lot of emphasis on quality and detailing. until production starts there’s always room for improvement. i’m happy to say, though, the general design has met its intent.

    ahsk2 -> none taken as you’re only voicing your personal opinion. some are valid, others are expected. i guess the acid test will be when we pull the covers off the car next year. or when the first few spyshots start appearing in nether Forums… would be interesting to hear what people say then, from both detractors and supporters alike.

  45. I have a feeling that those who bought the livina now are going to bite their own feet when they see the new proton mpv next year.

    I think, most people agrees that one of the virtues of proton is in the external styling department. However in the past they put too much on styling that they overlooked practicality (e.g. Gen-2 rear passenger head clearance). IMO Mazda cars are good example of a well balance design with style and practicality. Just look at the new Mazda 6, gorgeous yet spacious.

    Quality also was a well known weakness for Proton. But they are improving with each new model released. Many already realized that now which contributing to the success of the new Saga.

    So, if the new MPV have all these four characters: stylish, quality, practical yet affordable(for the target market), just expect another huge success for proton.

    Cheers! ๐Ÿ™‚

  46. Azlan, one important suggestion!

    Proton should offer the MPV in 2 different stylings, i) the usual mid-MPV type. ii) the SUV-like styling MPV eg: Toyota Rush (7-seater).

    As most of us know, the Rush is actually the MPV with higher ground clearance, and SUV-like external styling. Other than that, it is more or less a re-styled Toyota Avanza with different clothing. However, Proton does not have to go that far in changing the clothing, because that will incur too much additional cost, Just use the same bodywork, make higher ground clearance, restyled bumpers, add side garnish, etc. to make it looks more like a SUV. of course, there will be additional engineering works to be done as the vehicles sits higher, and its stability as well as handling tend to change.

    I am pretty sure alot of people prefers the SUV styling, especially young and mid-age family men, and young at hearts uncles. There is no need for a 4WD though.

    If that has not been considered, then please do! Bring it up to the management. By offering these options, the MPV will appeal to a wider group of buyers.

    Thanks..

  47. proton next midi mpv will easily beat grandlivina in styling department l guess or even practicality, interior finishing, affordable (price-wise) BUT cost of ownership, service quality dimension as well as frugality of the engine/vehicle.

    As far as i am concern Proton not really emphasize on this department, except lately in Campro+CPS but still can’t match the japanese makes.

    How to get higher torque at low rpm from Proton stable engines? Outsourced from establish Japanese is faster and easier option though not cheap. I’m degrading proton just to ensure Proton can survived with lesser investment and faster RoI.

    To have everything just make our MPV less competitive and pricier.

  48. nd -> ๐Ÿ™‚ … Mazda has indeed become more distinctive today than 5 years ago. I have much admiration for their design direction and management skills.

    BrusLi -> noted. but i’m a firm believer that a MPV must look and feel like a MPV, and not try to be something it isn’t. granted, lots of people like the SUV image but in reality not many would actually buy one. for our market, the primary reason is the price (bigger engine, wheels, etc.) and package constraint. SUV’s are still considered niche vehicles here and it will cost dearer e.g. the APX is a SUV; looks amazing but ended up not economically viable. honestly, do you think the Rush will sell in great numbers? being a SUV ‘lookalike’ but without the performance won’t win many admirers… except for diehard Toyota fans. it also looks very dated…

    nazri -> NGV? now that’s an idea…

    Karl -> procuring another OEM’s powerplant isn’t as easy as what most people imagine. the logistics, economics and engineering involved is enormous and time consuming. we have gone down this road before and due to our volume it hasn’t been able to take off.

  49. Azlan,
    Rush is too much overpriced by the greedy Toyota, I believe. At RM25K more than its siblings (Avanza), the car has nothing much to offer except for being SUV look-alike, and for that pricetag it will only appeal to the die hard toyota fans, as you said too.

    However, I believe, if the price is right, and just slightly higher than Avanza, it would certainly appeal to more people as there is quite a large group of buyers who buys suv just because of its look, not functionality.

    I have no idea much extra work is involved and how much development cost has to be added if proton were to offer this variant. Also I do not know how much extra bhp is required to compensate for the bigger wheels and other body styling parts. But, it may be worth considering.

  50. @azlina
    Wow, that’s a nice photoshop job u did editing Gen2 to look like an MPV!! It may come out lookin very close to that, as I believe the MPV n Gen2 can share the same side mirror n grille perhaps :D. The headlights remind me of previous gen Honda Civic hatchback (common in Europe, bt Honda Msia decide to make it saloon here)

    @Chaku
    Cool sketch there!! It rly does look like a Savvy MPV, oni much nicer……n on-paper-but-not-in-reality-due-to-cost-n-practicality, hehe.

    ——
    Toyota Rush?? Ewww…..

    I read motortrader’s article, the Rush n Avanza are supposed to be a “baby” IMV project. The IMV project is Toyota’s effort to maximise economy of scale, by buildin a platform which can be used to turn into a SUV, MPV, n pick-up truck, namely Fortuner, Innova, n Hilux. They also can use the same engine (there’s 2.5D option for Fortuner n Hilux, both same engine), anoder step into improving economy of scale.

    So wen Avanza rolled out, it’s oni a matter of time Toyota use its platform to make an SUV n pickup. It’s just that they’re all “baby” in comparison to Fortuner, Innova n hilux. So far, they’ve managed to roll our Avanza n Rush, dun b surprised if they wanna come out a 1.5 truck to rival Arena……it’ll def gonna be rubbish but then……it’s a “Toyota”

    On that note, I hv to say, Toyota is very clever n sly to roll out Rush. Its friggin expensive, utterly useless, impractical, half-hearted hybrid MPV-SUV, n yet……n yet……it’s a Toyota. Knowing Msian market, so long any car wears that badge, they’ll immediately buy it. It’s called badge snobbery, as Mel Lee (Car.My editor) writes it in this month’s Car.My.

    Mel Lee had oso test drove the Vios, n was disappointed wit its build quality. Too many inconsistent gap, the absolutely impractical meter panel in the middle is still there, overall, he felt the New Vios reeks of being cheap, not the pricetag though. How desperate can Toyota be in making fat plofit n negligible ross? Summor, this is comin from world’s no1 car manufacturer (may swap place wit no2 GM occasionally), it almost seem they’re mocking us.

    Tis no wonder Jeremy Clarkson is very agreeable on Jap, Korean n (sadly) our cars. He always said those cars aren’t built by a man who wanted to make a great car, but its built by an accountant. Wit exception to Honda (the oni Jap car manufacturer wit a proper historical tale of a man wit absolute passion for making car), the rest are built by a committee to make Japan/Korea/Msia rich.

    Putting the sarcasm aside, I think we can see why he’s frustrated wit Jap/Korean/Msian cars (except for selected Honda models, again). He’s afraid that their management would use a simpleton formula: “hey, we buird vely, vely leriabre n cheap car, we give customels good aftelsare selvice, then gualantee we can beat the Eulopeans n Amelicans. Linse n lepeat” (due to how Japs always replace “l” wit “r” n vice versa)

    Toyota demostrated they can make stylish MPVs, so there shud b no excuse to make stylish em…other categories of cars. But, they decided not to, n money matters come first rather than passion to make a great n “soul-ful” car.

    Though I wish he’d also give exception to Proton too ๐Ÿ˜‰ . Sure, Proton used to be “cheap n nasty”, but I do feel Proton is now “cheap n cheerful”, heheh. Compared to others, Proton have a talented designer like Azlano (banzai!!!), Lotus handling which can easily make the rest look like they’re made of cardboard ๐Ÿ˜€ n compared to other Msian car manufacturers, a proper R&D :). That said, I do feel confident Proton can show him that we can also build a car with “soul”, in terms of design, handling, quality, err…every aspect basically, hehehe ๐Ÿ˜€ . Let there be a day Proton is not just a committee founded to make Msia rich, but as passionate in the game of automotive industry as the European players!! Yeah!! ๐Ÿ˜€

    Speaking of which, Paultan just posted a news abt Syed Zainal announced the MPV is due in early 2009.

  51. First of all, I do not think that Rush is under IMV project. Fortuner, Hilux and Innova yes…but not Rush. Rush is from Daihatsu line-up…the Terios.

    Rush was supposed to be 4×4 5-seater SUV. But UMWT opted for 4×2 7-seater instead (why? that you have to ask them…heh heh…I know why but cannot answer lah…p&c)

    I have difficulties in trusting Mel Lee’s articles on Toyota models in Msia. I have yet to see an article from Mel complaining about Proton cars but when come to Toyota….whoa there!!…but in terms of profitability…I agree…

    As for Proton MPV, I hope the design wont be like 2 yrs back design (like some of our new Proton models)…means outdated already lah…

    I hope the design would be like 2 years ahead of time (like in 2011). I am in the opinion whereby designers should be creative and innovative…and imagine what kind of design would entice customers to buy, to love and appreciate in the future…its difficult…but I know Mr. Azlano likes challenges….challenge your self and be brave!!!

  52. Got info from my ‘insider’…hehe

    Proton MPV will look alike WISH and the price between 60-70.Am i right azlano?…huhu.

    But…he say the size is between avanza and….(he 4got the vehicle’s name)…

    Azlano?Can u clarify this?..I’m very upset if the size just like avanzo.

  53. Tokmoh was RIGHT we need a car with soul, can sell, cheap but reasonable features included, design-wise far ahead from the uglier but a product of revered brand name.

    Imagine we have decent design like Kia cee’d or Hyundai Genus and ready to compete with 2012 cars! Thus, our product easy to recognize with its subtle design (a la Apple in auto design).

    RUSH actually from Be-Go/Terios but possibly we got the tone down version as ASEAN Rush more toward Avanza than RUSH JDM/Terios/be-go with longer wheelbase. Without T-badge not many people willing to apart with their hard earned money for an Avanza BUT due the T-emblems Malaysians shown their true color, simply go for the brand.

  54. Hi, i just came across this topic, and i find it rather interesting as i always happen to feel excited and anxious each time a new Proton vehicle is being mentioned. Mr. Azlano what engine will it be using? CPS 1.6? or a new Campro 2.0 from Proton??

    I got a suggestion. Just keep the design simple but attractive. A little radical is ok, but don’t overdo it. Honestly, i like the Savvy’s design, but not many people have the same impression. As for the interior, i think it should include what people want in a MPV. (e.g cupholders, rear passenger AC vents, foldable 3rd row seats). No need for leather seats, and sunroof, just to keep the price below RM80K.

  55. Bro,

    Cabin comfort penting. Arrangement / cutting of panels make a lot of different utk keselesaan.
    Which is why I cannot drive an accord (I failed to pinpoint exactly the problems, spt susah nak masuk dlm kereta, driving position awkward) or city (tanki bawah + panel tepi menggangu) comfortably tapi civic OK kecuali minor discomfort kat handbrake yg kena kaki kiri …
    Sentra tak boleh tapi latio ok
    vios dan altis cannot ..
    206 ok tapi seating position akan buat takde space di belakang
    VIVA, myvi ok drive.. kenari kancil, kelisa n kembara tak ok ..
    lancer 2.0 tu OK ..
    semua KIA tak OK
    Hyundai Accent so – so .. kaki cramp kalau lama..
    semua proton, kecuali perdana, wira dan saga baru, tak OK utk drive…
    most of the time, it is not about interior volume tapi arrangement ..

    I wanted to replace my old perdana dgn Gen2/Persona/Waja/Savvy tapi satu pun tak boleh drive dgn OK .. mostly problem dengan stering rendah (At that time, mau saja aku pergi ketuk pintu RND proton suruh sample body aku supaya jadi guideline masa design interior layout utk future model.. )

    on the other hand, been in “national interest” RND myself, I suppose it is not easy to be where you are now. anyway tahniah diucapkan for recent products starting from Savvy up to Saga. Savvy is an excellent car.

    that’s all .. and all the best for next products dan jgn lupa aku masa design cabin

  56. @oranggila
    Oh…bt then again, Rush n Avanza use the same platform rite?

    4ร—4 5-seater sounds more like a proper SUV, bt 4 wheels r more expnsv than a pair of extra seats I suppose. Besides, FC will b high, more so it oni has 1.5 engine.

    SUVs oso tend to hv nvr wander off-road, T must’ve thought abt it. Seeing how desperate our market which worship its brand, they surely want to (overly-)max cut cost n make big money, even if that means killing the point of makin an SUV in the 1st place. Watever.

    Mel Lee is the oni other motor journalist aside from Chips Yap who’s been in the field for 30 yrs+, so somehow…bitter rivalry? Chips Yap, while noticing Proton’s change since Syed Zainal came, he still talks of his dark experience wit Ms Siemen, which is an ex-Proton staff who taunted him for posting Gen2 camouflaged images (this incident happened before Gen2 was released, n Proton was still under TM), that lead him to be interrogated at Bukin Aman Police Station!! Also, there’s always pessimistic reminders he would write of fearin Proton headin back to its dark times under TM whenever he writes anythin abt Proton. somehow, Chips oso seem to be pro-Perodua, n admitted he was a Toyota loyal before he got himself a Ford Escape.

    That said, Mel Lee can act as a check n balance to Chips’ remark on Proton, yohoho. Or it’s becuz I’m excited seeing someone actually tellin T to stop mocking us by taking every single desperate measure just to get richer. It would’ve been toleratable if they’re now havin financial nightmare like Proton (thankfully, it’s just over, bt still not the time to sit back n relax), Skoda (pre-VW takeover days), n Alfa, bt wen they seem to be headin a better-than-ever situation, to hv finally dethrone GM, that is unacceptable. That would be like a tan sri havin lunch at mamak everyday. While initially ppl may think “oh, he’s a humble guy”, later, ppl would think “what a cheapskate”.

  57. BrusLi -> greedy UMW-Toyota is more accurate…

    tokmoh & Karl -> a car with soul can only be achieved when it is designed by people with passion in car design. AND not only from the functional level but all the way up to the top. this will take time.. Rome wasn’t built in a day, right? credibility needs to be earned so that’s what we’re doing now, setting the building blocks for an exciting tomorrow!

    oranggila -> although i share your enthusiasm, our market isn’t like Europe or Japan. the MAJORITY of our consumers aren’t ‘design educated’ yet so they prefer safe designs. our culture will take time to be ‘cultured’ so it is our duty to lead them towards that, albeit in a controlled manner. too fast too soon will not be good in the long run. we at Proton Design can (and have) always think of amazing designs and solutions… some which i’m confident rivals even the greatest of our rivals. ;

    empeevee -> hmm… how well do you trust your insider?? ๐Ÿ˜‰

    nizam80 -> wait and see… but i share your opinion. my response to oranggila above says it all too!

  58. I just can’t wait to see the first spyshot of this new proton baby….

    I just did a research and found out that the first spyshots of the new saga was circulated on the net somewhere in Jun’07. About 6 months from the target release date.

    If the proton mpv target release date falls somewhere in Jan’09, then it should be on road test in about 5 months time. Or it could be earlier as you said Azlano, this is a totally new model built from the ground up.

  59. is savvy design radical?i can accept the design on first sight…savvy is a looker if u ask me.actually i prefer savvy overall design over New saga.New saga is too ‘safe’ in design sense,but again it is good for mass production car especially for our market.

    our market prefer conventional styling,they dun really like the ‘DARING TO CHANGE’ slogan (i mean in term of design wise).When the Gen2 first rolled out, most of my colleague said “what’s up with rear?so tonggek!”.but when the Persona rolled out, the same person said “persona punyer rear look normal skit, xlah mcm Gen2.

  60. @tokmoh
    Im not sure, but I was informed that Avanza and Rush shared the same platform.

    4×4 5-seater is ok for a SUV…but then, the plan was not to introduced the Rush as a SUV in the first place..not even at that price..

    Mel, I was shocked not because of what he wrote about Toyota cars (thats normal) but some of the irrelevant info he put in his article…

    Chips, I believe he made some really good comments on Proton and Dato Syed Zainal lately. Check out his MT website. As for the Bukit Aman, sape tak bengang bang…..hehehehhe…

    ok back to MPV….

    @azlano-san
    I was not thinking about having radical designs like when Chris Bangle came out with his BMW series…but more of like Gen2 when it was first introduced…that kind of feeling…Im not saying to have a design exactly like Gen2…but the feeling of it when people see the car…its not radical but the design is acceptable and appreciated….unfortunately, the Gen2 was a hatchback…and oso got other problems lah at that time….

    we do not need to “culture” the Malaysians.. we ourselves have yet to reach that level…As I have mentioned earlier….a design that is acceptable and appreciated, that would be the 1st stage….the 2nd stage, a design that can last long (or is it long last?), which I think is very difficult..

    then when Proton has reached that “BMW” level….we can go for radical design….for mass pro lah..in the meantime, we can show one or two radical designs to the public and get their feedback..(maybe we should try this for our future designs)

  61. Do not Bangle-ish Proton design yet. We need time and SOUL behind the badge.

    Remember not easy for first time for MB lover to accept round lights E-class in 1994? Or Bangle design at the beginning?

    BTW good mainstream design is inevitable. Saga was good though interior wise look cheaper than MyVi and ViosGong.

    Azlano,

    I always trust proton with it design, BUT l can say so for interior…seemingly “lost” in interior design especially Gen.2, Saga Mk 2 (though acceptable for that pricing). Is it the interior hand also kena ikat in this department?

    Love Proton though never own one yet.

  62. xsabar rasanye nk tgk design mpv nih.

    cm saga08, spyshots nmpk k.o, tp reality o.k.
    ramai org kata based on spyshots xcantik, tp alek2 lg ramai yg puji.
    Kudos 4 Proton!

    ape2 pn, aku harap handling mpv ni plg tidaknye cm persona la. aku driv gen2 & aku rs bes.

    psl T badge 2 lantaklah. design pn bknnye o.k sgt pn. sape ada $ ble la beli. your $ is yours.

    err..mpv ni nnt letakla signal kt side mirror, nmpk modern cket. guna led tail light.

    mpv ni drivetrain ape? frontwheel, rearwheel, allwheel?

    Viel Glรผck ๐Ÿ™‚

  63. Plan A Japs: Decide the price, then design around it.
    Plan B Germans: Decide the design, then put the price.

    Which plan is better ?

  64. Bro Azlan,

    Continue buat kerja. You layan semua orang you mati kerja tak siap and off course tak boleh please everyone (still you are kind enough to answer them kat your personal page)

    However (nak comment jugak) I believe dah sampai F-proto kan for sure, bila P proto (ikut master schedule)? The IP injection ka, slush moulding (betul ka ejaan)? gear lever kat floor ka, or steering mounted? Ada keyless with ignition button ka (tgk amazing race malaysian tak tau guna ignition, oh well kita tak biasa high spec even for corolla)? Trim banyak kain or plastic? grain besar ke kecik?2nd row seat boleh slide? Betul ke pakai GX-S platform? nanti pasang kat mana, PTM ke, MVF? Skang DPU sill below 2 ke? MSX/APX tuh buat tukun ke? sekian terima kasih!

    oh ya, UMWT tuh kena ketuk sket kepala dia sbb greedy (esp mktg). Readers, kalau tak puas hati, send to TTCAP/TMAP SG sound diorang baru dia tau hahahah

  65. utamakan quality…Sekurangnya Quality untuk local dan eksport model adalah sama..Jgn jadikan pengguna sebagai bahan kajian..sbb pengguna mula yakin dgn PROTON…

  66. All the best for the coming Malaysian People Vehicle ! ๐Ÿ™‚

    Since Azlano vows to keep the best part to himself (the design, the look and features) until the first sightings and spyshots fly all over the internet, what we can do best now is to keep our imagination running wild, and hoping for the best. Hopefully Proton will be able to deliver a good and maybe better alternative to the current market of mid-size people movers.

    thank you.

  67. will there be any Car clinic for this MPV? can i join ? ๐Ÿ˜›

    heheeh

    anyhoo, MPV need emphasize on storage lah.. a small 600ml bottle holder in saga is good… a 1.5l pet bottle is much better..
    how bout side storage… for kids putting in their stuff.. magazine and such.. maybe add chiller to the sidestorage..
    socket point to charge phone is also a plus point for rear passenger coz nowadays all people got phone and phone charging is a must for long travel… or company that move alot and need to use laptop. oh.. how bout hideaway laptop place.. but if it is mention as laptop place.. easier for theif to target that.. hehe.. so throw that idea out..
    how bout throw in some sunglass holder for driver and some map light found in 1st gen CRV..
    a close coin compartment.. a place to put umbrella.. maybe below the roof lining near the rear door.. considering malaysia is hujan country
    i like the under-the-steering-wheel compartment in savvy and saga mk2.
    what else.. waahh wishlist will come long way.. maybe if it cant be done for affordable version.. the B,M or H line.. maybe can introduce Gline.. (G=grand) for export… for me.. im ok for Gline for export model… as long as it exist and is made available to malaysian on demand.
    proton basher might not like this idea tho..

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